Curse

thunderai · Sep 05, 2007, 05:31 PM // 17:31

So there you are exploring a dungeon and you think you yourself, wait just a gosh darn second, i have seen this place before, and it was not here. A few dungeons use the very same layout in certain places and it freaks me out just a little.

Probaly as good an example is Vloxen Excavations. There are two areas in that dungeon that you see get reapeated in other dungeons.

Exp 1). In Bloodstone Caves, your starting position is the same as the starting position one the second level of Vloxen.

Exp 2). There is an area in Rragar's Menagerie that looks just like an area on the second level of Vloxen where you turn under the pillers and walk throught he swamp to get jumped by ooze. In this case that tunnel leads no where, but the layout, structure, texture, and everything else is the same.

Has anyone else seen areas on different dungeons that you swear you are standing in a different dungeon at that moment?

vergerefosh · Sep 05, 2007, 05:51 PM // 17:51

I think I know what you mean by the ooze area, with a pool and some coffins and things in the water? Think I've seen that maybe 3 or 4 times now

Turbobusa · Sep 05, 2007, 05:51 PM // 17:51

shards of orr lvl 3 + cathedral of fire = same big room.

thunderai · Sep 05, 2007, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

shards of orr lvl 3 + cathedral of fire = same big room.

I have not done Shards of Orr, besides the mad dash through it to get to Gadd's; however, having completed the Charr dungeon I can just imagien what it looks like.

Another interesting tidebit, in the preview weekend all of the areas which you can get to from the Light of Delrimore where accessable without the skill. I rememebr being miles away from the 'map' tunnel well into gray land.

On the topic at hand, it would seem the ooze pits, tunnels and all are recycled/used alot. I suppose this may have some 'lore' reasons, but it is sort of laxy to plug and play different 'room parts' together to create a new dungeon.

It still is a little odd when your walking through a dungeon fighting mobs when you look at the scenery and think to yourself, you have seen this all before.

Reflect · Sep 05, 2007, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turbobusa

shards of orr lvl 3 + cathedral of fire = same big room.

and the 4th Slaver`s exile boss room isjust the same
Level 3 frostmaw=secret lair of snowman

thunderai · Sep 05, 2007, 05:57 PM // 17:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reflect

and the 4th Slaver`s exile boss room isjust the same
Level 3 frostmaw=secret lair of snowman

Never noticed that before, but now that you point it out I do seem to recall it looking the same.

Onarik Amrak · Sep 05, 2007, 07:07 PM // 19:07

Anet is 1337 at recycling.

Ensign · Sep 05, 2007, 07:38 PM // 19:38

The first three sublevels of Slaver's Exile are gigantic copypaste jobs from other dungeons.

thunderai · Sep 05, 2007, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

The first three sublevels of Slaver's Exile are gigantic copypaste jobs from other dungeons.

The fact that they can be so easily copied makes me wonder what the application they (anet) use to make maps looks like. I suppose it would not be too diffiuclt to have a parts library and you plug parts into each other to make a new map. Thus the only real diffrence between dungeons being the mob layout and skills.

In hind-sight I say it may be unrealistic to have compeltly different dungeons which share no common elements, but the fact you can so easily tell the dungeons are copy/pasted makes me sad.

Perhaps if they didn't look so nice i would not pay attention, but since we are paying attention to what they look like you become fixated on the fact that you can tell they are duplicated.

My Sweet Revenga · Sep 05, 2007, 09:30 PM // 21:30

It's a pretty weak a** application if all it can do is take pre-existing map sections and staple them together.... Yeah I've been starting to experience some deja-vu moments too especially last night when I did the ooze pits.

ShadowbaneX · Sep 05, 2007, 10:05 PM // 22:05

I've seen quite a few dungeons and yeah, there are some repeats. I guess I can't really fault ANet for this. I mean they're in the middle of designing another HUGE game (GW2) and they're asked to work on this smaller project GW:EN. I can't really fault them on one level for reusing some areas, they've got alot of work to do and little time to do it in, but another part of me cries foul. I'm willing to bet that GW:EN received minimal workpower to get done (have you noticed that pathing in some towns doesn't work?), reskinned armours, copy and paste dungeons, etc.

I think they've done pretty good though, despite some of the corners that were cut.

HawkofStorms · Sep 05, 2007, 10:40 PM // 22:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

I've seen quite a few dungeons and yeah, there are some repeats. I guess I can't really fault ANet for this. I mean they're in the middle of designing another HUGE game (GW2) and they're asked to work on this smaller project GW:EN. I can't really fault them on one level for reusing some areas, they've got alot of work to do and little time to do it in, but another part of me cries foul. I'm willing to bet that GW:EN received minimal workpower to get done (have you noticed that pathing in some towns doesn't work?), reskinned armours, copy and paste dungeons, etc.

I think they've done pretty good though, despite some of the corners that were cut.

Of course you can fault them. This isn't a bunch of programmers making a freeware/conversion in their spare time. They are PAID to design content. They should release a polished and professional product and not cut corners.

lordgambit · Sep 05, 2007, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

I've seen quite a few dungeons and yeah, there are some repeats. I guess I can't really fault ANet for this. I mean they're in the middle of designing another HUGE game (GW2) and they're asked to work on this smaller project GW:EN. I can't really fault them on one level for reusing some areas, they've got alot of work to do and little time to do it in, but another part of me cries foul. I'm willing to bet that GW:EN received minimal workpower to get done (have you noticed that pathing in some towns doesn't work?), reskinned armours, copy and paste dungeons, etc.

I think they've done pretty good though, despite some of the corners that were cut.

It doesnt matter if they were working on GW2, they are selling us a product called Eye of the North, not GW2. The reuse is really heavy, I have almost all dungeons, and its all deja vu, the amount of reuse from my point of view was beyond what I expected...

I dont want to flame or anything, I liked a lot of things in EoN. being a software architect, i can understand the reuse too, that doesnt mean we have to like. I did pay for the game, and when you list xx dungeons and etc, people expect unique dungeons, not 5 maps, reused 20 times. It goes back to the same armor threads that are all over the place, it listed xx armor sets, yet it some was reskins, not new..

thunderai · Sep 05, 2007, 11:23 PM // 23:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordgambit

It doesnt matter if they were working on GW2, they are selling us a product called Eye of the North, not GW2. The reuse is really heavy, I have almost all dungeons, and its all deja vu, the amount of reuse from my point of view was beyond what I expected...

I dont want to flame or anything, I liked a lot of things in EoN. being a software architect, i can understand the reuse too, that doesnt mean we have to like. I did pay for the game, and when you list xx dungeons and etc, people expect unique dungeons, not 5 maps, reused 20 times. It goes back to the same armor threads that are all over the place, it listed xx armor sets, yet it some was reskins, not new..

In that lies the rub, it does not matter if they are currently woking on GW2. They made EotN to make a connection with GW2. The fact that EotN uses recycled content could lead us to determine that GW2 will use all recycled content. I dont think they would do that, but you dont know and probably they dont either.

One of my problems with recycled content is that it takes away from the seemingly random dungeon with its own special environment. Each dungeon is not unquie in the sence that they are different. They are 'different' and yet the same at the same time.

If making dungeons took away soo much time from GW2 perhaps they should take away more time from GW2 and focus on the hear and now rather than the supposedly future. The future is important, but the hear and now is where your sales are from.

I am getting sick of hearing about GW2 actually. I think the version is flawed, but more importantly I'd like to have dungeons that dont repeat content over and over again. I dont want to be in Vloxen and see the same envionment repeated down to the pixel in a different dungeon.

Charr dungeons should not look like a mining operation.

Ensign · Sep 05, 2007, 11:31 PM // 23:31

I expect sections of dungeons to be copied and stitched together to make more dungeons. You don't need to reinvent everything, if you mix things up enough everything is somewhat original. How many hallways or dining halls do you really need to design?

I did not expect an entire dungeon level to be repopulated and called a different dungeon. Especially when they already have the Sorrow's Furnace mechanic, where you change the quest and change the spawn.

thunderai · Sep 06, 2007, 12:01 AM // 00:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

I expect sections of dungeons to be copied and stitched together to make more dungeons. You don't need to reinvent everything, if you mix things up enough everything is somewhat original. How many hallways or dining halls do you really need to design?

I did not expect an entire dungeon level to be repopulated and called a different dungeon. Especially when they already have the Sorrow's Furnace mechanic, where you change the quest and change the spawn.

The question then is, how are regions map then. They do not stich together different hills, valleys etc to make maps. Do they?